this post was submitted on 08 Aug 2024
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...relative to Reddit's size?

I see so many posts and comments voicing disappointment with Lemmy's lack of massive expansion.

I too want to see Lemmy gain more users, but I do not want it to grow to Reddit's size. If Reddit is the yardstick, I'd say that a population that large attracts a lot of negative behaviours; degeneration of discourse, amplification of echo chambers and hive mind behaviour, etc...

I started on Reddit in 2010 and found that by 2016 things were really bad in comparison. A fun and engaging site was experiencing an obvious devolution that persists to this day, accelerated by Spez's enshittification of the platform. Obviously the fediverse insulates us from that occurring here but I think you get what I mean.

Do you you think Lemmy is too small? I don't. I've been here since the great migration last year and have had a really good time. I see a lot of familiar names in the comments on a daily basis. It actually feels like a community here. I guess I just don't understand the fixation on the size of Lemmy's user base. Curious to hear your thoughts.

[EDIT] Thanks for all the responses, everyone! Lots of perspectives I hadn't yet considered.

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[–] [email protected] 199 points 1 month ago (1 children)

The smaller population overall isn't a bad thing, but it can really be felt in smaller or niche communities. Reddit's huge size is a plus in this regard, because chances you can find at least a semi-active community for just about any hobby or niche interest.

[–] [email protected] 48 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (1 children)

Yeah, I'd actually forgotten about it since I've been here for so long but the joke "there's a sub for everything" is actually completely true and one of the things I miss, even if it's an inactive community you can 80% of the time find a subreddit with a few dozen posts to check out. I used to just hit "random" until I found an interesting one. I feel like I'd cycle through all the communities on my instance in a couple of days.

That being said I love the small feeling here compared to Reddit and if I had to choose between "small community with conversation" and "unlimited dopamine trickle tap" I'd rather it stay as it is

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (2 children)

The smaller subreddits are still good on reddit, as long as they have a good focus. They are effectively their own little communities

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[–] [email protected] 73 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Because that's what I'm missing. I like the apps, I like the site, but I need content. And not memes or politics, but specific niche topics. The nice thing about Reddit is that there's more than enough content about basically anything. Non mainstream music (DnB, Hardstyle, Trance), games, hobbies. There are always hundreds ,if not thousands of people engaging. I don't want a discussion with 3 other people, I want a large community that can actually provide me with a lot of new information and keeps itself going without any effort from my end.

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[–] [email protected] 53 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Some years ago Reddit had such a large reach in the media space that you could be discussing something on there and news outlets would pick up on it. For a brief period it actually felt like a platform where ordinary people could get heard and influence the world outside of Reddit or at least sway opinions of other real users. The reason why it worked was the massive userbase. The high profile AMA's drew quite the crowd. Those days are long gone. It's been a long time I saw any serious news outlets report on what happens on Reddit. GameStop was probably the last big Reddit thing to make a dent on the outside world.

I don't want Lemmy to be that big, but it would be nice to know that if you make effort to write something that is important to you, that it gets read by more than two other people who already have the same opinion.

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[–] [email protected] 51 points 1 month ago (5 children)

For example the Formula 1 live threads during a race has like 10 comments on Lemmy, while on Reddit it's in the thousands. Just wish some communities were a bit more popular.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 month ago

Yes. For communities that on Reddit were small to medium size there was a critical mass of people to sustain large, lively threads, particularly during live events. Lemmy currently lacks that, outside of the letter tech, politics and meme communities. And for the smaller communities, activity can be almost non existent.

Then the federated nature of Lemmy allows for duplicate communities on different instances. This is not inherently a bad thing, particularly for larger interest areas as it helps prevent a particular sub group from dominating discussion in an area. But fracturing of smaller communities can make just finding an active one more difficult. I know that this is a feature in many ways, but it does have tradeoffs that have to be acknowledged.

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[–] [email protected] 42 points 1 month ago (3 children)

Because there are only a handful of communities that have enough traffic to sustain a meaningful conversation.

Even popular activities have low traffic, god forbid you want to participate in a community based around a niche activity.

I love Lemmy and I'm not going back to reddit... But sometimes it feels like a desolate wasteland here.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I agree. The smaller communities is nice, but when it's so small that each post has less that 5 comments, I feel the conversations are limited.

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[–] [email protected] 42 points 1 month ago

The flagship communities are quite alive, but the niche communities have not really taken off. I am talking from both the absence of such communities, and my experience trying to migrate !fluidmechanics. The subreddit has around 10k humans (or bots).

[–] [email protected] 39 points 1 month ago (1 children)

It highly depends on what you're here for. Some communities have gathered enough active members to expect a continuous influx of posts and comments.

The strength that Reddit has built over the years is that many niche communities also thrived and turned into a rich repository of knowledge that was searchable. Lemmy isn't there yet, if you're into fishing, knitting, Japanese chess or sourdough baking.

But it also doesn't need to be a perfect drop in replacement for Reddit, it's probably fine if it remains something different, slightly fringe and a friendly place that doesn't require massive amount of servers and moderation staff.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (1 children)

Japanese chess

For anyone curious it's also called Shogi.

And if there is a lemmy community for it out there let me know. :D

Edit: I think my client bugged out with an off by one error but might be corrected

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

I chose this example because I'm an avid Shōgi player :-)

There is a community on my instance, but nobody ever posted anything. Maybe I could post a couple of Tsume from some books I have, or some castling strats.

https://discuss.tchncs.de/c/shogi

EDIT:

First post in the community: https://discuss.tchncs.de/post/20104621

[–] [email protected] 38 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (5 children)

it's like 90% IT nerds here lol. whether you want growth or not depend on how okay you are with that. I love you guys but a lot of your hobbies bore me to shit and I want someone to talk to

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[–] [email protected] 37 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Well, for me, the site has very little to offer because I'm not into USA politics (I check on them, but that is not why I was on Reddit to begin with), and that is more or less the only topic with a self sustained community besides meme pages. So yes, I do want this place to grow, not a little, a lot.

[–] [email protected] 36 points 1 month ago (2 children)

When i was using reddit, my feed was 90% cats and i was subscribed to hundreds of cat subreddits

Lemmy doesnt have enough cats

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 month ago

I blame this partially on a lack of good video support

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[–] [email protected] 27 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I want all people to use Lemmy.

I want us to stop the tribalism. What made reddit fail was the management, not the users.

Yes some people suck, and if you ask me it's most people, but diversity is powerful and without it we have no future.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (1 children)

Reddit hasn’t completely failed yet. If it had, it wouldn’t have so many users. The users are preventing it from failing.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 month ago

Definitely true, I suppose I meant it failed us.

[–] [email protected] 26 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Because the communities I care about are getting less than one post per month.

Come join us at [email protected]

[–] [email protected] 24 points 1 month ago

Like others already pointed out, it’s not about the size per se. It’s about the small odd communities of specific interest that we miss. These usually only thrive with numbers.

Then again, I used Lemmy for over a year and didn’t get a single death threat. I went back to check my Reddit account and had two in my inbox, I didn’t use the site since the exodus. Soooooooo, yeah. You win some you loose some.

[–] [email protected] 24 points 1 month ago (1 children)

On Reddit I went to specific subreddits and things were bubbling there, on Lemmy I pretty much have to stay on All to get any active content. I really don't want Lemmy to reach eternal September, but we definitely need much more activity and a much larger user base than we currently have.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 month ago

Same here. On the upside, "All“ on Lemmy has a much higher quality than what Reddit had in the past years. I really enjoy my daily doomscroll on Lemmy.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 month ago

I just miss there being more variance in the voices I see in the comments. On Reddit, the size made it so that you were pretty much always seeing new commenters, and seeing a lot of different discussions. But here, I mostly see the same ~50 regulars across all the communities I subscribe to, and almost all the same discussions being had.

Overall I still prefer it here, but more users and more active communities would be nice, too.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 month ago

I want the world to use open source tools.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 month ago (4 children)

Does anyone remember the inside jokes in the early days of reddit?

When does the narwhal bacon? Orangered Chuck Testa!! Ridiculously photogenic guy And of course the long list of meme-level posts like broken arms, cumbox, celebrity AMAs

This type of community humor made a lot of people feel like they'd found their tribe on reddit in those early days.

I haven't seen much like this develop on Lemmy yet, possibly because there's so many disparate communities merging. I'm not really sure. Or maybe all those 20-something redditors are now pushing 40.

I think it will take a while for a lemmy culture to develop and the community won't attract outsiders much until it does.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 month ago

I need to not poop for three days.

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[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 month ago (8 children)

As a mod of three niche Soulslike communities, one of which that probably has less than 10 active users at best, it's really hard to put out quality content and keep a community alive all on your own. I had to resort to a bot filling two of the communities with regular posts so there is some semblance of life in the communities, but reception has been mixed so far and the engagement didn't grow as much as I had hoped.

Unfortunately, I don't see any other way for these communities to be sustainable if like 95% of users on here are lurkers. Plus, I'm not the best fit for moderation and pumping out posts asking for engagement constantly since I'm a lurker at heart myself.

'All' is pretty good, though. It's where I spend most my time on Lemmy.

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[–] [email protected] 20 points 1 month ago (2 children)

There are a lot of communities missing. I cant find anything financial related like /personalFinance, /financialIndependence, /povertyFinance, /frugal with any decent amount of interaction. Most with maybe 1 post or a handful of comments every month. Without gaining a lot of users there isnt enough content to stay

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[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 month ago (1 children)

On [email protected] there's a weekly thread called "How are you doing with your communities?" It's for/by all the people who single-handedly keep niche communities alive by posting regularly. It can be a tough job, and easy to burn out. That's because of the relatively small population here on Lemmy.

However, I agree that I like the culture here better. On Reddit, even when I blocked ads I still felt like I was being marketed to and manipulated.

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 month ago (1 children)

This is of course only my opinion but I want it much bigger but maybe not the size of reddit. I like being able to have a problem and going into the specialized community to ask the pros. Online searching is currently slowing down results. AI searches will tell someone to use an outlet to fix a pipe and if someone searching for something they don't know may try figuring out why their pipe doesn't even have a plug. I also like to research into things HEAVILY and having a community where I can sift through thousands of posts to form an idea of what I'm looking to learn is nice.

With that said I can't knock lemmy any because the community that has 150 people will have 125 of them respond to anything you post.

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I want more small communities with people who really like specific things. For example if you want to buy a robot vacuum going to a community about it is very nice to read up on what people find important and maybe issues with a particular model. Even the memes sometimes have great info (think something like a popular vacuum that doesn't pick up anything with "At least you tried" or spongebob meme pointing at stuff of increasing sizes referencing areas the vacuum missed)

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 month ago

Example meme I just created for robo vacs which I'd like to see in the some robovac community.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I’d really like to see more posts come through, without the dip into the “copy Reddit posts” kind of thing. When I open Reddit, I can read 100 posts of varying topics, refresh an hour later and have a lot of new posts to ingest. Lemmy doesn’t have that much activity, so I end up looking at a very similar “popular” feed this morning, this afternoon, this evening. And 1/4 of those posts will also be in my feed again the next day.

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 month ago

I want the niche communities to fill out but otherwise I agree.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 month ago

I don't think it's the size but more the number of communities and how active they are. So if there are more people here it hopefully means there will be more active users as well. And perhaps more niche communities.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 month ago

Network effect matters

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 month ago

Im looking at it from a whole fediverse perspective but its large enough as is to be enjoyable. If it gets larger fine, if not fine. I just want it to develop to have as much freedom as possible and give as much control as possible to the individual for their experience.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (1 children)

most online users, like well over 90%, don't post or comment with any regularity, that's just how online activity works.

coming from Reddit, lurkers are expecting unlimited content in any community to consistently appear, without internalizing that it is users creating that content

Lemmy lurkers are the people that need to add content if they want to see more content.

I agree that lemmy is fine the way it is, getting a few new users every day, a few new communities, consistent quality posts and actual conversation instead of the chaotic morass that Reddit easily devolves into with so many posts.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago

Reddit has the same dynamics. Smaller niche communities there were awesome, the massive ones were full of toxicity. Here, the large communities are the size of small Reddit boards, which is good, but many niche communities here are unfortunately too sparse to thrive.

I don't think Lemmy must grow. In fact I like the relative obscurity that tends to make it a better quality of user. But at this size, it's less of a one-stop shop than Reddit. I miss the Reddit cigar community. They aren't really in favor, particularly with the left, and there isn't the critical mass to sustain that here. So I just don't talk about them which unfortunately leaves me less informed about what's going on in that world.

That so being said, I agree with the thrust of your post which is that Lemmy is just fine at this size. It is.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago

There’s also a number of them indirectly trying to use the numbers to trash talk Lemmy. Personally, I would prefer the quality over quantity you can see here on Lemmy.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago (3 children)

Reddit took over a decade to get to that size, it's not a fair comparison.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago

I mainly used Reddit for communities dedicated to niche games and hobbies. None of those communities exist on the Fediverse, because the venn diagram of very niche interests x Fedi itself being niche has too little overlap. Fedi would have to be substantially bigger to replicate that part of Reddit, only when there are a ton of users to begin with will I be able to find the small percentage of them who also want to talk about the stuff I want to talk about.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago

Because I want to see Reddit fail.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 month ago

Bunch of size queens around here.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 month ago

Give it some time and you will see what Lemmy is capable of.

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